with Ma Ananda Sarita

Debra Pascali-Bonaro: Hello, what do you know about Tantra? Have you considered Tantra as a preparation for an ecstatic and orgasmic birth? How can Tantra help to cultivate inner ecstasy before conception and birth? 

Hi, I’m Debra Pascali-Bonaro, host of the Orgasmic Birth Podcast. I am here today with someone that I have to tell you, I am so honored to talk with you and learn. My guest today is Ma Ananda Sarita. She is a world renowned Tantra Master and Mystic, offering courses, retreats and training throughout the world. Having lived in OSHA’s physical presence for 16 years, and 26 years in his community. She received direct transmission from him on meditation and Tantra. She is true to the spiritual essence of tantra and guides her students on the path of Self Realization. At the same time, she helps people and her students transcend the psychological issues that we are carried as a result, both of cultural conditioning and past experiences. She is a Master Healer, Author of two books, and a producer, director of tantra online courses, and Tantra meditation, music and downloads. And stay tuned at the very end because she’s offering so many great opportunities to learn more. 

But for now, welcome. It is truly an honor. For those that are watching, we’re meeting in Bali this morning. For the very first time when I arrived on the island and saw that she was here, I immediately reached out and thought, what a gift to be able to be in your presence and to really hear your own words about your work, and also your wisdom for all those that might be preparing for conception, or for you tell me a little bit about your journey, and what Tantra is?

Ma Ananda Sarita: I’d like to extend a very high regard to any woman who has given birth, or is considering getting pregnant and giving birth. Because I feel very passionately about this subject that orgasmic birth is a real possibility for women throughout the world. And it does tie in with Tantra, and also with ayurveda. I’m also very passionate about ayurveda as well as tantra and meditation. And I think all of this links together. I believe that in the past, tantra, ayurveda and yoga were all sides of the same tree of life. And as human beings, we need to reclaim this as a coherent and sane way forward for our societies and our cultures throughout the world. Now, it might be interesting to know that in contrast to our method methodologies for conscious conception, conscious pregnancy and birth, in ayurveda, they have an entire protocol for mothers who are pregnant. They also have a protocol. So the optimal way to conceive, and I think we’ll go into that in more detail in a little while. But this is just a nutshell and then about tantra in particular. It is a spiritual path to enlightenment. It’s using everything that the human being, whatever we are, whether that is our senses, our emotions, the chakra system, kundalini energy expanded states of intelligence and consciousness. Tantra will work with all of these different aspects and apply the message of meditation to any of these aspects of life. And of course, that includes our sexuality, that also includes pregnancy, birth, or whatever it is we are going through as human beings. And in a nutshell, tantra is a weaving together of love. And meditation and witnessing is more of a masculine approach to spirituality. While love and devotion is very naturally a feminine approach to spirituality. When we weave these two approaches together, then we have contrast, so this is what tantra is in a nutshell. And it utilizes methods of meditation with a very loving, devotional, sacred ambience. And these methods are applied to every life experience. 

There is a scripture from the world of tantra, which is called the Vigyan Bhairav of Tantra. I just like to say a little bit about it, because it’s actually very romantic. It’s the most romantic scripture, I think, that exists on the earth because it is delivered as a dialogue between Lloyd Shiva and his beloved. The scene is (inaudible), and she was loved. She’s asking questions about life, love, spirituality, and he is giving answers. And each one of his answers is one method of meditation. And these are delivered in sutra form. A sutra is a very short, condensed spiritual teaching. So whatever she’s asking, instead of giving her a philosophical answer, he is giving her a message. By practicing the method, her own innate intelligence will start bubbling up. And she will find herself gradually expanding in her awareness and receiving the anchor through her own lived experience. So this indicates to us that sutra is based on experience, and also on awakening our own innate intelligence. And this is done through utilizing methods, because the method will give you the opportunity to live this experience. Now, I’ll just say one of the sutra’s which I think is very relevant for mothers which is, as a hen mother mother her chick, particular knowledge, particular doing. So this quality of mothering, other hens, mothers are chicks. Now, just imagine all these chicks, they run all over. So she has to be in a very aware state of multitasking because she’s mothering all these chicks that are running. And we all know that women are very, very interested in multitasking. And we’re given that gift by nature because we have to mother children, and children are also running all around. They get into mischief, and you have to be very aware. So this sutra is basically telling us that motherhood in itself can be a path of meditation, and that we can apply this quality of mothering to anything that we do to optimize it to bring it out. 

Now, there’s another sutra that I really love, and this is a sutra that I heard from my master Osho. When I first met him, it was the very first meeting. When I met him, I was 17 years old. I had hitchhiked to North America. I left my home when I was 15, which is also North America. Then I took one flight to the UK and then I hitchhiked all through Europe overland through the Middle East, to India. By the time I reached India, I was 17. And the first thing that happened to me was that I found myself in Bodh Gaya, which is the place where Buddha got enlightened, and I learned the partner meditation. I did a 10 day silent retreat, and this was my introduction into meditation. And then I was traveling to Mumbai to do a month-long retreat that was going on. I think many people have heard of growing conflict so it was with going directly the night before that Muslim retreat, I met Osho. This was through an acquaintance that I met in a backpacker hotel. And he just said, I’m going to meet a very interesting man tonight, maybe you would like to come. So I said, okay. I was always up for some adventure. So I went there, and there was about 30 people dressed in orange. They were sitting in meditation. This man has not explained to me anything about Osho. At that time, he was known as level one. So I was just sitting in meditation and then Osho loaded into the room, it looked like that, because his mood was so grateful. He sat in an easy chair, and he started giving discourse on the Vigyan Bhairav of Sutra. The sutra he was commenting on that evening was as follows, while engaged in sexual union, stay attentive on the fire in the beginning. And so continuing, avoid the embers in the end. So he gave a magnificent discourse, an hour and a half discourse on the sutra commenting on sexuality according to sutra. Bringing awareness to the sexual art and helping us to achieve long lasting sexual union, which is so steaming on many, many levels. 

Now, this is relevant to our conversation. Because when we are engaged in very conscious sexual union, that leads us to conscious conception. There is a very ancient tradition in both Tantra and Ayurveda. You do ritual meditation, you call in the type of soul that you would like to incarnate in to you. So they have special rituals for that special mindset. Because according to your particular quality of mind, your approach, you will call in that kind of soul. And also in ayurveda, they do quite an amazing preparation that couple would go through what is called ayurveda contract cardamom. And this is cleansing you on multiple levels. So it cleanses both the female and the male, and then the ayurveda astrologer would determine the best day and time for conception after the cardamom. What it does is it optimizes the quality of both the sperm and the egg. During the punch of cardamom, a couple is not allowed to have sex, they just go through a lot of records on all levels, body, mind, soul. Then after that, the ayurveda astrologer says the best day and time to conceive. So you wait for that day and time, which is going to ensure that the sperm and the egg are optimum potency. And you do special ritual to call in a conscious conception. So this is something beautiful. This has been lost in our culture. People are absolutely unaware of this. 

In America, 50% of babies are not even planned so there’s a difference between planning. Conscious conception takes it to a whole nother level. And if you combine that with tantric meditation, so you bring in this meditative sacred quality into that sexual union, of course, you are optimizing your potential immensely. Now, even women who are having trouble conceiving many times, they will be helped by doing a punch of cardamom, and then going into the conception. Because as I said before, it’s optimizing the egg and the sperm, both. It’s not sufficient if only the woman goes because it takes two to tango. Obviously, we have the sperm and the egg, and they need to be of a high caliber. So the health, both the male and the female is very, very important. Because then, we will have a stronger child. And that also has implications for generations into the future. We need to optimize our own health because that ensures that the generations into the future. It’s also optimized. Of course, that’s a concern. 

We should always think of those generations into the future. And also, just on another subject during the pregnancy, in ayurveda, they take care of the mother in very specific ways. So through very specific ways of eating, through special kinds of massages as well. And that includes at some point some special kind of internal massage. At different times in the pregnancy, different protocols are followed. And that ensures a very easy birth process. Now after the birth, they don’t stop with the birth. After the birth, they have special protocols where mothers are really nurtured and taken care of for at least three months. They are given a very regular and special kind of massage, even special foods, special care. Different kinds of mantras are chanted, and both baby and mother are cared for in this way. And it’s a time of deep bonding between the mother and the child. And this is thought to be of absolute importance for the good development of the child. So this is a really interesting process, which I think is so important,and I wish that it could be adopted in the western world as well. 

Debra Pascali-Bonaro: Yes, I couldn’t agree more. Is this still carried on very commonly in India?

Ma Ananda Sarita: Anywhere where there is a strong presence of ayurveda, this would still be followed. And I happened to be present with my diabetic doctor. The doctor was giving birth, I wasn’t at the actual birth, but I was there as the process was going on. So the doctor explained all these things to me and I was so deeply touched. I actually wrote a newsletter about it. This just spreads the good news to people. This is an option which can be followed. Now, I had the good fortune to meet another woman who is very prominent in the natural healing process. Her name is Dr. Gowri Motha. She lives in England. She originated from Sri Lanka, so she developed what is called The Gentle Birth Method. And she wrote a book called The Gentle Birth Method, and another book called Gentle First Year. Her story is very interesting because she was raised in Sri Lanka, she became a doctor surgeon, and then she was going to the UK to continue being a doctor. And she was specializing in birth. Now, what she found out was in Sri Lanka, for native land, women might be working in the fields. It was time for birth, they would just squat down, give birth, put the baby on the back and go on working. So in essence, they were having basically a smooth, easy, almost painless birth. Then she went to the UK, and she found that birth is treated almost like a disease. People were in a phobia, terrified of the pain, needing so much intervention. She said, something is not right. Because in my native land, it’s so easy. And why is it so difficult here? So she wanted to make a difference for women. She went about establishing her natural birth process, which holds a gentle birth method. 

Now in her book, she outlines everything the woman needs to do throughout her pregnancy in order to lead to a painless birth. I’ve had friends who follow the book, and they didn’t even meet Dr. Gowri. They read the book, followed the protocol and were able to achieve a painless birth. So one of the protocols she outlines is to stop eating gluten during the pregnancy. The reason is, because gluten creates walling in the whole body, even the brain tissues, or the soft tissues, and that includes the yoni. I’m calling the female genital YONI, this is a Sanskrit word which means sacred place. So I prefer it to the terms that are used in our English language or in many other languages. The term is not really honoring, so this is why I use the term yoni. So the tissue of the yoni also swells up. And she says, this is why many times women need interventions because there’s no space for the baby to come through, because the tissue is too small. So if a woman does not eat gluten during pregnancy, the yoni will be much easier, more open to the birthing process. And then it’s highly possible that she can give natural birth without needing to be touched, etcetera. So this coupled with massage. Internal massage at certain times during the pregnancy is very important. 

Debra Pascali-Bonaro: Who does the internal massage? 

Ma Ananda Sarita: The book told exactly how to do the massage, and then her partner could do it. Or if she doesn’t have a partner, she can find a trusted friend to offer these massages. So this is a very important site. And then in addition to that, she’s also giving exactly what supplements to take, what kinds of foods to eat, what kind of exercises, like yoga style of exercises to do. And she has a special self hypnosis process to de-hypnotise a woman from believing that birth is painful. And this is very important. Because apparently, if we are believing or thinking about things, the pleasure aspect of our body will shut down, and we will not produce leisure hormones. If we are focusing on leisure, the pain producing possibilities in our body will become much less. 

So with this self hypnosis process which the woman does throughout her pregnancy, she trains herself to believe in leisure, and that will fuel the leisure potential of the body. And I think this is a really compassionate thing that we’ve done to give this possibility for women. Because in essence, women have been hypnotized to believe that it’s painful. It’s really a hypnosis. So we need to de-condition ourselves from that, and reclaim more of a natural approach where we really trust and believe in our bodies. And it’s very obvious that the clitoris and equatorial network have 8000 nerve endings devoted to pleasure. So if we tap into that pictorial network as we are going towards birth, and during birth, this will be very much supporting to have an orgasm. But I think this is really important to understand this situation, this possibility and potential. And then also going about it in her second book, Gentle First Year, she’s emphasizing how important it is for mother and child bonding after the birth. That this is of supreme importance for the future well being of the incoming child. 

Debra Pascali-Bonaro: I just have to say, I love how you talked about how we’ve been, as a culture, women around the world hypnotized into pain, and I couldn’t agree with you more. I’m really interested in how we can open up and go deeper into pleasure. Many of our people listening would like that pleasurable orgasmic birth, but are struggling. I know that you’re giving them lots of tips, but what other ways could they access Tantra? What other ways do you see that they can decondition from the pain and be more connected to love and pleasure?

Ma Ananda Sarita: This is very, very important. Just before I go into that subject, I wanted to talk about a film, which I think maybe many of our watchers or listeners have already seen. It’s called, Birth As We Know It. This is a supreme film. If you haven’t watched it, just go there and watch it. Because this is also about giving birth in water, and about trusting our body and how it is of a natural birth. And they show so many births. So just watching that, there is already a strong deconditioning just to watch the film. And she’s also emphasizing emotional rigidity practices as a very important aspect of leading up to a positive and even orgasmic birthing process. Because we shouldn’t underestimate our emotions, and what that can do to us as we are carrying the child and giving birth. Because basically, our limbic system has been programmed to our own birth when we were born. And so if our own birth was not at the optimum, we need to be conditioned, release that trauma, and open ourselves to rewriting our own inner script, and then we will be able to give birth passing down this huge script that we have embodied through that emotional process. Now, when I teach Tantra groups, emotional fluidity is an integral part. Because so many of us are carrying trauma or wounding from our past that we need to unwind, release, and then we can open more easily to our inner ecstasy because the template and default of every human being is actually bleeding, and this is very important to understand. There’s another book which I highly recommend which is called Molecules of Emotion. 

Debra Pascali-Bonaro: Yes, I know that book well. 

Ma Ananda Sarita: And this book is outlining how our emotions, mind and body work synergistically together. And in that book, the author makes a very important statement that human beings are hardwired for bliss. This is our natural template, and she found that out through laboratory studies. So this is what makes it really a very important statement. Mystics have been saying that down the ages, but we haven’t really understood. But if you read this book and you trust the science, which all the research has gone into, then it’s like an aha moment. Oh, so I’m hardwired for bliss. And if I’m not following my bliss and I’m going in the wrong direction, I have to adjust my life so that I can come back to that original template. And this is very integral to this tantra approach. Because basically, any tantra methodology will bring us back to our original template for less. And I like to quote another sutra which you can tie with your partner. And this is really exquisite. It’s very simple to practice. This is called caressing meditation. 

Debra Pascali-Bonaro: I like the name. 

Ma Ananda Sarita: So the sutra is, while being caressed, sweet princess enter the caress as everlasting life. You get goosebumps with this sutra. I do every, every time. So this is the most mind blowing meditation. In this meditation, you are sensitizing the entire body. Now, why is it so effective? Because the body is always in the present moment. And when you are extensively in the present moment, it brings you into the experience of, you are beyond time and money. So the body is one of the best portals into right states of meditation where you go into timeless space, you’re in tune with your beliefs, your inner ecstasy. And on top of that depressing meditation sensitizes the entire body. And in that sense, it also heals sexual dysfunction of all kinds. Now, the way to practice this meditation is one partner lays down on their belly, the other partner sits by the side. You, first of all, make a caress on some soft tissue like either fingertip, or maybe the four fingers, or maybe the whole head, and you ask your receiving partner which kind of caress you prefer. And the receiving partner will say, oh, maybe the fingertip, or maybe the whole thing, or maybe a whole hand, and then using only that kind of chorus for the entire meditation. And then you begin caressing, and you cover the entire back so you don’t leave anything on caress. You need to correct from the head to the toes, and you just simply cover the entire body taking approximately 10 minutes. And then you ask your partner to turn over and you caress the entire body talking for about 10 minutes. So it’s very slow, very meditative as you are giving the caress. The giver is in a state of meditation, the receiver is also in a state of meditation. You’re using only one hand. Because if you use your hands, it’s distracting. 

So the person needs to focus on the sensation of that, that medication that’s beautiful, and it sensitizes the entire body. And after that 20 minutes of one receiving, then you exchange, and the other partner exchanges and proceeds. And it’s very nice to receive the sutra at the beginning on the back. And again, at the beginning on the front at the end of the 20 minutes. You just stay in silence for maybe two minutes, letting the process integrate, then you can bring a singing bowl maybe two or three times to indicate now that it’s complete. And after that, you can go into lovemaking and you’ll see that both of you have become so exquisitely sensitized. That quality of the sacredness of touch, moving beyond time and space, and just being open to eternity through the tap, you will be in a state of blissful awareness. And then you take that into your lovemaking, the lovemaking will have a completely different quality. So this is just giving you a taste of what is possible through tantra. And I really recommend that you try it. It’s absolutely amazing. 

And strangely enough, that ancient sutra, which is at least 5000 years old, links to something that happened in our modern world, which is the discoveries of Masters and Johnson. They were a team who researched all about sexuality. They wrote a seminal book on that. And recently, there’s been a film on Netflix, which is called Masters of Sex, which dramatized their whole discovery and talked about it. There’s a book by the same name Masters of Sex, which describes their findings, which is really interesting. But they were helping people who had sexual dysfunction to find fulfillment in sex, utilizing what they have found through their scientific research. The research is very, very interesting. They busted certain meats, for example. One of the things they discovered is what is called the sensate focus exercise. And basically, it’s very similar to caressing meditation. They describe that if somebody has sexual dysfunction, you use this very soft caressing over the entire body. So you sensitize the entire body, and through that, the sexual dysfunction disappears. Of course, you have to do it 10 times. You can’t just do it one time, there’s a prescribed number of times that you must do this. And that gradually, the person’s sexual dysfunction will simply heal by using this method. So I think it’s fascinating. You have something coming from the ancient and anything coming from our modern research, and they need adverbs. And it is increasingly like that between science and spirituality. What the mystics have been saying for thousands of years, scientists are now realizing, oh, actually, that’s true for my scientific findings as well. 

Debra Pascali-Bonaro: It’s true. And we’re coming back. Even in childbirth, we’re realizing how much we can learn, and the tradition of the path is all coming together. My heart is singing, my oxytocin is flowing, I feel it all. I know for all our listeners, they’d love to find out how they can connect with you. I know you’re there in Bali offering some amazing programs and other things online as well. Share with everyone, and we’ll put this all in the show notes, as well as the books to recommend. 

Ma Ananda Sarita: So for those of you who can’t travel to Bali or Europe, because I’m working with a team. So me and my team, we offer in-country courses in Bali, India and Europe, and this includes courses with couples, as well as singles. I have developed seven levels for the couples called the Soulmate series. And it takes three and a half years if you want to do all seven levels. It’s basically taking couples on the journey of a lifetime deeper and deeper into intimacy, and the potential that is inherent in your union bringing together sexuality, love and spirituality. This is an absolutely phenomenal opportunity. And I also offer one of those courses. One of them is called Master Lover. I have an online course by the same name. And this course is offered for couples, and I have another version for singles. Because the information in it and the experience of it to people, I find many people are lacking in a coherent sexual education. Maybe they’ve learned about sex, they never learned it properly because it’s not taught properly in schools. So having a sexual education with tantra principles is huge. That education is really, really important that’s why I developed Master Lover and why I spread it. You can do an online course. 

And then I have another course for couples. It’s a one off course which is called Ocean of Bliss. And this is devoted to Osho’s teachings, his direct discourses about tantric sexuality in the couple. And so I just created a course all around. I offer that both in Thailand and in Bali. And on top of that, I also have many different courses, for example, (inaudible) series, which is for women only. And I also have the Goddess Essence teacher training. I have a series which is focusing on the chakras, and I have a teacher training for that. So this is the Tantra Mastery series. And there’s a tantric teacher training based on that series. And then I also have Tantra Yoga teacher training. So that’s weaving together yoga and Tantra with a blend of Ayurvedic principles in it. Then I have another group called Tantra Transformation which deals with stuck emotional patterns from days in our life and helps to unwind and we write the script. So this is very important if somebody would like to become pregnant and they feel like, oh, I need to unwind. This move is really, really good for that. And then of course, I also have a group on Vigyan Bhairav Tantra, which happens in India every year. And through that group, I’m covering the 112 methods. And that takes place in three parts. So if you want to do all the hundreds, well, you can come for three years in a row. Otherwise, you can just do one of them just to have a taste of Vigyan Bhairav Tantra. 

Debra Pascali-Bonaro: And where can people learn about all of this? 

Ma Ananda Sarita: Well, I have the Instagram account, Ma Ananda Sarita. Facebook, Ma Ananda Sarita. Website, anandasarita.com. It’s really helpful. If you subscribe to my newsletter, I have a regular newsletter that comes out on multitudes of different subjects and you can even ask your burning question. I can create a newsletter based on your question if you desire. So you can say, I have a burning question about this. I would really love a newsletter devoted to this, and I can do that. So don’t hesitate to send in your questions. I’m always happy to answer them, whether that is through a written message or a newsletter. And yeah, I have a passion for tantra, spreading the good news and the wonderful experience of tantra’s throughout the world. Because I think this will then lead to coherence in our society, a wonderful society based on love, meditation, place, and it’s easily attainable for people everywhere, because it’s not something you add on top. It’s a coming back home to who we are in our very innate essence. 

Debra Pascali-Bonaro: Thank you so much, Sarita, I could stay all day, truly, with you and in your wisdom and love. I feel it so deeply in my heart. I thank you all who have joined us. We hope that you will share this episode with friends and family. We all need to come home to our love and our essence. We want to hear from you. We always love for you to send us your comments. What is your takeaway? What are you going to integrate into your practice and your life? And we hope you’ll join us for our next episode of the Orgasmic Birth Podcast.